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Inside Edition: Former Player Talks About John Thompson III, the "System" and Talent

Former John Thompson Jr. player "Bashful" weights in on criticism of John Thompson III and his system.

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There has been much consternation about the recent two losses by the Hoyas and after the Cincinnati game some criticism of Coach JTIII emerged on this and other blogs. After my good friend Sleepy Hoya has penned a somewhat facetious article this week, I thought the discussion deserved a more detailed look. The focus of the dyspepsia revolves around the "Georgetown/ Princeton" offense and its effectiveness in the Big East (strategic concerns) and, of course, the tactical considerations of substituting, play calling after time outs and other coaching decisions.

Star-divide

So from a big picture standpoint, I would make three observations:

  1. Overall Career Success - The current season is JTIII's 12th season coaching an NCAA team. He has won 4 league championships, has appeared in post season tournaments 10 of 11 seasons and has won 70% of the games he has coached for GU. This is an elite level of success. By comparison his father won 71.5% of games.
  2. Coaching Style and Success - JTIII has coached this style of offense his entire career. He has won in the Big East with the talents of Jeff Green and Roy Hibbert but his teams have relatively underperformed the last few years because of first round losses in the last three post seasons.
  3. Pre-season vs. the Big East - The last few years the Hoyas have done very well in nonconference play versus the Big East regular season schedule. Does this have to do with the difference in talent between the opponents, the familiarity of the Big East opponents or some other factors.

The overall answer as far as I am concerned is that the jury is still out. It is clear that with tremendous talent and great chemistry this can be a successful style of play as the 2006-2008 teams showed. It is also clear that teams with tremendous talent have not played as well. I always thought that Chris Wright was poor fit for the offense because he was a scorer who leveraged his ability to break people down off the dribble. He also had an historically high levels of turnovers. The offense does best when your point guard is a good ball handler who facilitates movement, spacing and timely penetration (e.g. Jon Wallace). And secondly, the team the last few years was just too small for Big East success.

The current team is well positioned to execute in this offense. Markel Starks is a good ball handler, who is unselfish, can penetrate and can spot up for jumpers. Hollis Thompson is an outstanding spot up shooter who can draw the defense out and open up opportunities inside. Henry Sims is a really good passer both at the top of the key and down low. And the rest of the squad is developing nicely to fit into the system and they seem to have the mindset for success.

So what has gone wrong? Not that much so far. 13-3 and a top 25 ranking are accomplishments. The team is deeper and plays better defense than the teams of the last few years. The team is significantly taller than the last few teams. And the team is young and hopefully will learn from their mistakes. The last four games represented underperformance of the team's abilities and need to studied and corrected. My humble observations:

  1. In all of the last four games the team experienced significant periods of offensive lulls. The last three quarters of the Providence game; the middle 20 minutes of the Marquette game; large portions of the WVU and Cincy games. Most of these seem to come when the team falls back into executing the offense around the perimeter of the three point line. They fall into passing and moving after the pass but never make the move to have the ball penetrate inside. This accomplishes two bad things. It allows the defense to wait on passing lanes and force turnovers or results in bad shots too far from the basket. Against Marquette, they broke this tendency in the second half when Jason Clark came out and consistently drove to the hoop. The next thing you know he's getting to the foul line and things opened up when they adjusted to stop his drives and that opened the floor for Henry to be our point forward and find people cutting. Movement and spacing are keys to this offense but so is penetration.
  2. When the ball comes into the high or low post we often see our cutters crowding the player with the ball. This has been one of our main sources of turnovers. We need to cut with spacing to the hoop. This gives the point forward the option of finding the cutter or seeing if a player has become open on the outside due to adjustments by the defense.
  3. Correct these two tendencies and the turnovers will go down.
  4. The last thing is that the team needs to develop more of a killer instinct. We have teams on the run and then we just go back to "running our sets". Don't do that. Keep penetrating, keep getting to the foul line and keep finding Hollis when he is hot. He doesn't have to be just a spot up three point shooter - he has developed a very nice post up fade away jump shot that is virtually unstoppable when he is covered by anybody 6'6" or smaller. But don't settle for just running the sets.

I think this team will rebound and outperform expectations this year. If they don't the jury may be coming back into the courtroom on the Georgetown/ Princeton offense.

0 recs  |  37 comments

Comments

Excellent perspective

If you would have told me before the season that through 16 games the Hoyas would be 13-3 and a nationally ranked powerhouse, I probably would have punched you in the face.

JTII is my boy - but just no more late season collapses

By that I don’t mean just March wins – but getting a top four league finish. The last three years the BE schedule have been a roller coaster and we have not cracked 11 wins- 7-11, 10-8, 10-8. Just want us to finish off a BE season and it makes forgiving March must easier.

Wire seasons has to be 4, 3, 2, 5, 1. But maybe I just have a weakness for the greek.

why are you punishing season 1?

Best to worst is 4, 3, 1, 2, 5.

One was good, but a little uneven

Although the whole newspaper theme was a bit hackneyed – the finale in 5 brought it back up – leaving 1 in last place. Sort of like most would rank Lubbick as our worst starter, although he is still pretty good.

I always thought 2 was the worst...

3, 4, 1, 5, 2

3 and 4 =1a and 1b

any time unemployed stevedores are a major plot point

its going to be a tough sell, but I still like 2 – mainly because it was such a switch from where you thought the show was heading after season 1. 4 is still the single best season of any show in the history of the world. Bubbles gets me every damn time.

2 is better...

after 4 and 5 tie the importance of the Greek back in to what Marlo is doing. The ports in B-more are important.

I think it goes 4, 3, 1, 2, 5.

young

Look, my take on this is that the team is young and is bound to make some of these mistakes due to their inexperience. We have had several games where the team let the game get close and we ended up pulling off the win (Alabama) comes to mind. A young team is going to win some of those and lose some. I believe this team has lots of talent and will outperform our initial expectations. We are going to lose more games and we will win lots more.

Lets not forget one thing. – Our initial expectations coming into this season was this was going to be a building year and we were a middle of the pack team. We are 13-3, I think that is very impressive and my take is we will win 20 games this season. Not bad for a middle of the pack team.

i think this is spot on

we could have easily lost alabama and marquette, and won wvu and cincy. if this happened, would people be as disappointed?

+1
thanks for the insight, bashful

definitely don’t understand (a) the season-collapse hysteria or (b) why people have suddenly forgotten that our initial expectations for the lil whippersnappers this season were, you know, next to zero.

Excellent perspective
I think one of the reasons we seem to be "running our sets"

is Big East opponents have come out well-prepared to defend our offensive style and then when we try to execute that style, we’re essentially blocked. Thus it looks like we’re not trying to get the ball inside, we are, they’re just defending against what we’re trying to do.

That’s on the coach, when that happens he needs to have the team prepared with a “Plan B,” which we really have not had the last two games. The last two opponents have shut down the inside penetration, and its effectively killed our ability to get shots,

We seem to not be able to get any open 3’s unless our offense is clicking inside. It would be nice if JTIII could put some wrinkles into the offense (maybe more ball screens) to free up Hollis, Jason and Markel for 3’s occasionally.

Also as JTIII stated after the last game, a lot of the turnovers have been “unforced,” meaning its not just because we don’t have anywhere to go with the ball, its also because the passer has made some dumb decisions with the ball (e.g. long lob passes over two or three opposing players or being careless with the ball when the defender is looking for the steal). Yes the team is young, but thats something JTIII needs to get across to the team, because its really hurting their chances.

As we as 'casual fans' know

is that the ‘system’ isn’t flawed at all (even though proponents talk down to recruits about, it’s too old school, it’s focuses on too much team work etc…)

Rather it’s from an ‘over-reliance’, and thinkin’ that it will always prevail, minor tweeks to it (depending upon what the D gives you) will display JT3 acceptance of evolving on what is happening and trusting his players to work it through!

As always

bashful provides tremendous insight and an even keel to all his analysis.

pt. #4 is spot on, in my humble opinion.

JTIII's system is fine and

is no worse or better than any other sytem. Of course it works better when you have players like Green, Hibert or Monroe it. They were very good players that executed at a high level. Every system looks better when you have good players executing it properly.

OT: Can we take Bolden off the twitter feed?

Not only are his tweets a total waste, but I think you have to average more than 2 pts, 2 rebounds in high school to warrant inclusion in GU hoopster tweetdeck.

I've been BEGGING for this

Behind the scenes. Hopefully now that you asked, Hire Esherick will comply. He didn’t comply with my request because he hates me.

how about if i chime in & ask nicely too?

because…it’s painful

Can we add DSR though??
I have no opinion on the bold one btw
i didnt comply with your request because i have been traveling

now i will not comply with your request out of spite

Thirded...

More prolific and less entertaining than Trawick

Keep him in

Reminder that we still need a big

And second DSR
dsr is on there

but his tweets are private/protected

it looks like we have to go to Clark creating offense early and often. The rest of the offense will follow…

Virginia runs an offense even more boring than us....

Yet they are 14-1 and sticking with Duke right now at Cameron because they DON’T TURN THE BALL OVER AGAIN AND AGAIN. It can be done if we just take care of the ball.

Defense and ball control. They are so fundamentally sound.
true

but duke sucks. always and forever

blog dead

calm before the storm…?

That's exactly what it is

Hoya Nation taking week to rest/refocus. The grind begins tomorrow.

Liveblog last year's game @SJU?
i thought live blog rewatches

were banned

If not, they should be

After the last two games though, my cynicism is running high.

It is not he system per se....

….but the reluctance to adapt, modify, adjust, react, etc when it is just not working well or opponents have it figured out. This is one obvious explanation for our better success outside of the conference than in the Big East – where coaches know well what we are going to be doing.

I have much respect for bashful and his views. Yet I detect less clear cut support for JTIII’s sytem than I have picked up in previous bashful posts. The jury is still out.

But to repeat…………….the system is fine…………when it can be executed. Where we fall down is when we meet the unexpected on defense (or frankly on offense where our postseason history is marked by being torched by a single player). As sleepy has noted, none of us really know what we are talking about, but we have ideas, plans, strategies to deal with the adversity which is thrown at us. It is frustrating to see JTIII holding up the same old fingers and running through the sets (on offense and defense) when it is plain not working.

I think we will be fine this year……….but I will be an ugly poster if we lose to St. Johns.

With paranoia,

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